Ambassador Mike Gbasha was the deputy chief of mission of Nigeria to the United States and head of mission to the Gambia High Commission. In this exclusive interview with NATHANIEL GBAORON, the octogenarian bares his mind on the high level of insecurity in Nigeria, zoning of 2023 Presidency, among other issues. Excerpts:
In the next few days (April 1st, 2020) you will be 81 years old, how do you feel at this age?
Well, I feel great; am grateful to my God who has brought me to this stage. If I have gotten to this age and talking to you freely, you can see am reading, I read the tiniest print without using glasses; so, I feel great that God loves me.
May we know a little about your life; your trajectory in life?
My life has been a life of up and down; the good the bad and the ugly. I have seen all of these. I started as a child of a farmer that treked distance of miles to school from Mbagbera the present Vandikya in Benue to Gboko. At the age of 10, I went for an interview to attend a middle school in Katsina Ala; I spent three days on the road; returned back the same three days. I later rose to the peak of my career as a permanent secretary for five years. In my diplomatic service; the highest was an Ambassadorial appointment. I served as deputy chief of mission in Washington DC for three years; I headed a Commission of Nigeria High Commission to the Gambia from United States from 1981 until Buhari retired us in 1984. In the public service, I served in two important Commissions. Member of the National Electoral Commission from 1989 to 1993; I served as a Federal Character commissioner, from 1995 to 2001 and a member of the Constitutional Review Committee. In politics, when I was dragged into it by the then governor of Benue State, George Akume, I headed politics in the north central. I was the chairman of the elders’ forum ACN, PDP and SDP. I was the first to lunch APC in Vandikya, Benue State. Along the line, I didn’t agree with the politics of the leaders because I refused to be a praise singer, a sycophant or a hypocrite. When things were not going the direction I thought it should, I stepped aside. I think God has blessed me at 81 years. I still have a sharp memory to recall happenings in my secondary school days from 1951 till today 2020; I still can remember vividly my life span and what I have done.
Ambassador, you worked closely with the late Sardauna of Sokoto, Sir Ahmadu Bello; could you compare leadership then and what is happening now?
I always tell Nigerians that Ahmadu Bello, the Sardauna of Sokoto (may his soul rest in peace) died with the leadership of this country. Sardauna had a very good and clear vision for the progress of this country. Unfortunately, the enemies of Nigeria’s progress cut him short and he went away with it. It will take us time to have a leader like Sardauna of Sokoto, the leader with a vision; not only vision but a clear vision and understanding of what it takes to build a country like Nigeria; he went with it. Am not saying we don’t have good leaders, Nigeria has good leaders but you always have the best, and Sardauna was the best leader Nigeria ever produced. He had a vision to have a great united Nigeria; I had wished he lived long to put Nigeria where he wanted it to be; Nigeria would have been a different and a great country.
There is high level of insecurity in the country ranging from Kidnapping, banditry, Boko Haram to herdsmen attacks. What do you think is responsible for this?
It will be difficult for me to tell you categorically what the problem of insecurity in Nigeria is, because they are many. There is a saying that a hungry man is an angry man. Are Nigerians hungry or they are well fed? In the past, we had four regions- the north, the east, the west and the mid west. The sharing of positions along the line was the beginning of Nigeria’s problem and a coup came in between and shortly we moved into twelve states. If you look round the states, are the states equally developed? Where is the fault? Why are other states developed and others are are backward? If you move from Benue to Nasarawa State, two common things- light and water- are very big problem. When God was creating the world, the first thing he created was light; let there be light and there was light, for creation to continue. The second was water. Move from Benue to Lafia which is an appendix of Benue, you see traffic light on the road, but there is no light in Benue State. Gboko, the major city of the Tiv people has no such social amenities. So, are Nigerians living happily? Why are others living in affluence while others are suffering? I think this is the cause of insecurity in this country. There are so many other dimensions and time will not permit me to mention all of them. But I think the leadership of Nigeria is bad. Am not talking about Mr. President only, am talking about the governors, the chairmen, the senators, the House of Representatives members. When there is unhappiness, can people think well? It has become survival of the fittest. The problem of insecurity is more than something I can just give you now; they are very dimensional but the major one is that Nigerians are not satisfied with the leadership of this country.
So what do you think is the solution?
The solution lies in the hands of God. If our leaders can imbibe the leadership that Jesus Christ brought to this world, leadership that Jesus Christ told Peter that if I don’t wash your feet you have no cause with me. He went to a level where he could bend down and wash the feet of his disciples. Am not saying our leaders should wash people’s feet, but there should be that understanding because a leader without followers and followers without leaders cannot produce the best.
The activities of Fulani herdsmen are the major problem of farmers in the country; do you think there is more to grazing of their cows?
That is too big a question to answer. This country is too big for one section to take over. Christians cannot rule Nigeria alone; Fulanis cannot rule Nigeria alone, Nigeria is too diverse. What seem to be the problem is lack of understanding; l don’t think the Fulanis want to take over the country. The closest friends of Fulanis are the Tiv people from time immemorial; that’s where the word Munchi came from. It is only the Tivs and the Fulanis that know the meaning of Munchi, how it came about. They have lived many years ago without problem even the cattle rearing that we are talking about has existed for years. What is the problem now? Somewhere along the line we have missed the code of togetherness of Nigerian society. The Tivs, the Fulanis, the Igbos, the Hausas, the Yorubas, the Jukuns, name them, need to sit back and think. I will quote what Professor Jerry Gana said years ago about a leader ‘if you’re a governor govern well, if you’re a president, president well, if you’re a manager, manage well and if you’re a driver, drive well.’ Lead well if given any opportunity. We can’t live without one another, and those were the things sir Ahmadu Bello was preaching.
Where do you think the 2023 presidency should be zoned to, owing to the agitations already going on from various places?
Yes, the 1999 Nigerian Constitution as amended and the Federal Character principles require that each segment of the country must enjoy the leadership of the country. I was a member of the Federal Character Commission that zoned the country into six geopolitical zones- three in the north, three in the south. When we proposed these zones, the zone called north central zone wasn’t there, it was the middle belt zone; that’s what many people don’t know. North East, North West and Middle Belt zones were in the northern part of Nigeria. In the south, it was south west, south east and the southern minority zones. The coming into the proximity of Abuja by Niger State from the zone of Sokoto because of nearness to Abuja with Babangida leadership changed the two names; Middle belt zone became north central automatically; Southern minority zone became south-south zone. The argument was that some of them were not part of the fight for middle belt. I don’t want to take that seriously. We established these zones and also enlarged the leadership that Mr. President and the vice president, the Senate President and the deputy Senate President, speaker of the House of Representatives and deputy speaker of the House so that each of the six geopolitical zones must be in government. Meaning if the president is from any of the northern zones, the vice president must come to any of the southern zones and in that order. If things were done well there shouldn’t be problem at all from where leadership goes. When we proposed this arrangement, it was one term round. So, within 24 years Nigeria would have experienced the rotation of leadership. If it went well, Nigeria would have maintained that system. Unfortunately, the first leadership that came into power at the first independence election decided to hold it long. Instead of one year term, they took two terms. That’s why under Obasanjo and Atiku Abubakar, the third term came in, it became a problem. Nigeria started this two-term and the governors accepted the same thing. Unfortunately, nobody has ever mentioned the chairmen at the third tier of government; they are left outside; that one is another imbalance. But, some people argued that how many number of years have the north ruled and how many years have the south ruled. That’s the imbalance we are talking about. Within the three zones in the north, has the North Central produced a president since independence? Are we talking about that? Everyone believes that if the presidency is to come to the north, it is the term of Benue to produce a president. Are we thinking about that? So, the imbalance as to whether or not the northern zones have ruled less or more or the three southern zones have ruled more or less is immaterial because the Igbos have, at least, produced a president and a vice president but the people of north central have not. The question of the presidency going to the East looks good but how will the other people feel? We really want to have peace in this country. We should love our neighbour as we love ourselves; what is good for one person should be good to the other.
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